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sine effect and scroller preset time

 
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Poplinski



Joined: 25 Mar 2013
Posts: 37
Location: Malm�, Sweden

PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 8:00 pm    Post subject: sine effect and scroller preset time Reply with quote

Very Happy
Hi!
I am a frquent and very entusiastic LX user and have just tried out the new effects panel, really good new features! One thing I am missing since using a Martin M console a while ago is an effect engine that uses curves such as sine to generate effects, e g a chase for a range of channels or even pan tilt movements. I guess it should be possible to do this, the great advantage would be no need for programming cues to be put in a row but rather specifying a range of channels or subchannels plus a range e g every 1st, 2nd, all... and a desired behaviour of those. Do you know what I mean?
Another thing I would be happy about is a default time for "presets" or subchannel values to fade up and down with, in order to not run scrollers at full speed which smashes the rolls. Old AVAB consoles had this as a standard when patching a scroller..THis would even be nice for other devices as full speed moves with for example a moving head is very demanding for the mechanics.


Thanks!!
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admin
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Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 1550

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LXConsole now has channel based effects in addition to the original preset based effets. If there's interest, it may be possible to add effects that vary by a function such as sin/cos instead of linearly over time.

LXConsole has a command Channel->Delay Hilited Channels that will create a new part to a cue and start that after the main part is finished. An application would be fading out lights with color changers and then changing the frame after the lights are completely out.

The latest build also has a broader Delay Channels command that allows you to select all sub-channels except intensity and place them in a delayed part to the cue. When your subchannel change involved movers and scrollers, you could choose Channel->Delay Channels... and uncheck intensity from the list of subchannels. Then, you lights would fade and after that was complete, the subchannels would go to their new levels.
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Poplinski



Joined: 25 Mar 2013
Posts: 37
Location: Malm�, Sweden

PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy Oh thanks, this delayed channels function sounds cool, actually a "moveinblack" ! I will look into it.
About the effects, I would REALLY want to be able to do effects based on a sine or similar variations, fr example working with aLED tube that takes 48 channels. It is possible to do nice pixel effects but takes a lot of time to program even with channel effectx. I would like tlo be able to do this:
Select a range of channels or subchannels e g all 1-48 (*x)
Select every 1, or 2nd or 3r or...
Apply a function to the selection.
This can result, depending on which channels are chosen, a simple dimmer chase or a figure 8 (pan/tilt) effect with a moving light.
CHeers!
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Poplinski



Joined: 25 Mar 2013
Posts: 37
Location: Malm�, Sweden

PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A console that uses this kind of priciple is MArtin m2go, check out the effects section in the manual.
http://www.martin.com/en-US/Product-Details/M2GO

uli
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Poplinski



Joined: 25 Mar 2013
Posts: 37
Location: Malm�, Sweden

PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy One more little request, talking about the rgb led tubes, I actually patched them as a fixture with 3 subchannels at some point, red green blue. The lamp itself has a crappy dmx protokoll with no dimmer.
I thought maybe the intensity slider in the channel control window would work as a virtual dimmer, but it did not.
This would be useful!
I could use the slider in the color window in the same manner but I assume that what we talked about earlier with delaying subchannels to make a color change invisible, would not work like this either.
Thanks!!
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admin
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Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Posts: 1550

PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its not OK to read another product's manual and copy its features. If, there is a way to describe what you'd like LXConsole to be able to do and then there's a way to figure out how to do that within its design, that is a legitimate discussion.

There's been some other discussion about effects that are function based. I'm assuming that means something like l=f(t) where the output level of the effect for a channel is generated by function f for any given elapsed time, t.

One possible way this would be implemented is to normalize the time value for the desired loop. If you wanted a p second loop and were inputting that into a trigonometric function, it might be something like l = 50 * ( sin(2*pi*t/p) + 1 ). This would produce a sine wave that went from 50% to 100% to 50% to 0% and back to 50% in 5 seconds. As long as you wanted the sin to be in this range, you'd only need to supply the time period p and it would be relatively easy to implement. Its not a lot harder to add min/max values for the range of levels to the equation. l = min + ((max-min) * ( sin(2*pi*t/p) + 1 )) /2. The actual mathematics might be variable and could be generalized as l = f(t, p, max, min).

This seems possible to implement if it is useful. My question is how this applies to a set of channels. I can see pan and tilt where pan = f(t, p[1], max[1], min[1]) and tilt = f(t, p[2], max[2], min[2]). So the pan could be oscillating at one speed between two levels while the tilt did the same over a different period and different levels. But, I'm not sure how this applies to a range of leds. Would the value of t be offset so each channel would follow the sine wave in a sequential manner? led[1] = f(t+k0, p, max, min); led[2] = f(t+k1, p, max, min); ... led[n] = f(t+kn, p, max, min)?

This ideaor something like it could be added to a future version of LXConsole (after the current version is finished and released). The current latest build is close to being a release candidate for v4.0. But, there's been little feedback on its improvements. So, it probably needs to be out a while longer before it is possible to move on to something new like this.

Although it is a separate question, how does "move in black" apply to LEDs? Sophisticated LED fixtures curve their output to try to achieve consistant color over dimming. But, that feature should be implemented at the fixture rather than the controller.
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lanternz



Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 187
Location: Adelaide

PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 6:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Admin, congratulations on your soundly ethical stance regarding intellectual property theft expressed in the first sentence of your last post. We are proud of you and of the unique software you create.
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Lanternz
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Poplinski



Joined: 25 Mar 2013
Posts: 37
Location: Malm�, Sweden

PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, that was a bit clumsy of me about the manual...
It seems that you can see a technical solution of what I tried to explain.
To make it a bit clearer:
The reason for my request was to avoid programming cue chases.
To apply this kind of function you described to one channel would do the job of for example 2 cues, one with a max value and one with a minimum. A further development would be to choose a range of channels, apply the function. Then those channels would do the same thing. Next apply an offset, spreading out the channels along the timeline or the wavelenght of the function. Maybe then we would have to extend to several wavelenghts to for example make the channels chase one after another or even overlap, I don`t know. E g we choose 4 channels and an offset of 0, they would do the same thing simultanously. Offset 4: they would do the same thing one after another. Offset 2 or 3 : one after another but overlapping. Offset >4 follow with a certain interval inbetween.
A further development would be to choose a range of channels, and then apply a subselection: every 1, 2 , 3.... Used for arrays of lamps or my led fixtures that use 16x3 channels rgb. In order to make single green led run around: choose ch 1-46, every 3rd, apply function with offset 16. That would make the green leds in the tube light one after another , chasing.
About the "moving black" I mentioned , it is already realized by the cue part function. I found this useful when I wanted the fixtures to change color after the dimmer fade. I don`t know if you read what I wrote about the "virtual dimmer"? As any channel with subchannels automatically uses sub ch 0 intensity, it would be nice to be able to adjust the general output with it, like a virtual dimmer, for fixtures that donThave a mechanical one, like my leds. Then, the "movinblack" could also be automated, using the tracking function to read a fixtures values for subchannels in the following cue and adjust them automatically once or if the intensity has faded to black.
I hope this explains what I meant .
Thanks for your support!
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